Wilkes states that the producers told him to hit on Jon's wife Nicole, leading to a violent and physical confrontation. They are just part of the cast and play their role as builders to develop successful homesteads. But many of things they install like a POS system, bar taps, seats, tables are on lease, the show covers the fee for a few months then it is up to the owners to take over the lease terms. In the meantime, here are 10 things Taffer revealed to me about his life and Bar Rescue: Heyyy! 5. The episode about the work airs on the Discovery Channel Thursday at 8 p.m. Copyright 2008-2023 BroBible. Its funny, itsentertaining, and you learn something nearly every episode. If so, how much and for how long? Interestingly enough, the couple, Kevin and Brittany, eventually apologized to Gary and Maria for purposely making their business look bad. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Other. From cheap ingredients to overpouring, it's obvious why Jon Taffer rolls up to these establishments. He now lives in Las Vegas, which is where he decided to set Bar Rescues latest season (which premiered on May 2). The total price for labor and materials per bathtub is $102.09, coming in between $65.26 . For over 30 years, Nightclub & Bar Show chairman Jon Taffer has traveled the country saving hundreds of bars from failure and ruin. Marty and his family do not contribute a dime toward renovations! Has there ever been a fight on Bar Rescue? Jon Taffer earned most of his money from reality TV series. We even leave them with food & beverage inventory, along with plates, silverware, glassware, and everything they need. Similarly, a lighting company might do the lighting in exchange for exposure. At the start of the show, there is an epic meltdown by the owner who controlled a minority stake in the bar, Nellie. The irony of it all -- "Bar Rescue" now streams on Paramount, so there's to sticking it to the man. Who pays for Bar Rescue improvements? Theyre in debt, theyve had to move out of their home. Email my producer [emailprotected] with your phone number and question. The Property Brothers also reportedly pay for costs . Youd be stunned to find how many people say to my producers and such, Oh, hes not going to scream at me. The owner doesn't pay one dime. 2023 Glossyfied.com | hello@glossyfied.com, interview about his reality television show, The Reason Subway Restaurants Always Have The Same Distinctive Smell. He spoke to all his four children about joining the show, and it took a month before Matt and Misty finally decided to come on board and work with their father to help fellow homesteaders. When I leave the bar that night, thats normally at around 2 in the morning or so. While Jon Taffer is largely known as the hot-headed host of Bar Rescue, he is also a successful entrepreneur that created the concept of NFL Sunday Ticket, according to Bro Bible. Sometimes, people get involved in the bar business for the wrong reasons. Who pays for Bar Rescue improvements? This way, the owners only need to focus on keeping the establishment open. It makes editing much easier. When I started Bar Rescue, I said to the network, Listen guys. We also use third-party cookies that help us analyze and understand how you use this website. As special projects director at Taffer Dynamics, a consulting firm for hospitality brands, she manages her and her husband Jons office and oversees product sales and Jons travels and calendar. Of course they are going to blame it on someone else. To be considered for the show, Mashed noted thatbar owners must sign an application form and submit it to the Paramount Network for consideration. When you see me talk to the staff after the stress test, thats really late at night. After that, "The TV network covers many of the high-level costs. To blindfold them and reveal their own businesses to them is unbelievably exciting and rewarding. Everyone knows I am a big Bar Rescue fan. Who Pays For Renovations On Bar Rescue According to Jon Taffer, Jon and the show's sponsors pay for literally everything. Improvements coming to I-480 near Cleveland . Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site! This can be including that Taffer is evaluating the actual bar to be redone and scouting competing bars. The Show's Bar Owners Speak Out - 10 Gone Viral, DiscoverNet | The Untold Truth Of Bar Rescue, DiscoverNet | Rules Bars Have To Follow On Bar Rescue, Bar Rescue: 10 choses les plus fausses sur le spectacle, selon les acteurs et l'quipe - Sird, 10 choses les plus fausses propos de la srie, selon les acteurs et l'quipe - 9to5Fortnite. Murphys Law in Reno is depicted on the fifth season of Bar Rescue.. Cleveland police search for hit-and-run driver who mowed down hairdresser outside of a bar. Jon Taffer saves bars that are on the verge of shutting down on his reality show Bar Rescue. The problem people are sooo outrageous to then have such a significant turn around in one day, is now not even credible. Cracks me up that the episode of the chileens was about two drunk owners.. they abruptly stop drinking (dangerous) and he gets them recovery help but then the mother and daughter do recon a couple seasons later and she orders alcohol???? She says the place lost thousands of dollars worth of equipment and personal belongings. Bar bussines is no different a other bussines, you have to work smarter, stay away from bad practices, control the cost whitout sacrifice quality, and be present all the time, otherwise, the gift will be lost. He said: "Everything to do with the project comes out of our pockets.". In 2014, a guest on the show says he was told to flirt with Jon's wife and then was physically attacked by Jon. I got a chance to briefly chat over the phone with Taffer last week. 4 Who pays for renovations on Bar Rescue? Is A Hot Dog A Sandwich? Her episode, titled Emergency Exit, portrayed Maria as an entitled, spoiled distraction who was sucking the life out of a bar called Murphys Law in Reno. It is believed that 89 of the first 201 bars featured on the show have since failed and closed their doors, giving Bar Rescue a success rate of just 56% (according toReality TV Updates). Because of this, there was no better man to lead Bar Rescue. Taffer's blunt delivery can be problematic with business owners but it made great TV. The re-model is out of this world. Do you cover the cost of the renovations and upgrades or do the bar owners have to pay some of it back? All filming was complete by March 15, 2015. And you know, after Zanzibar, Murphys is probably the angriest Ive gotten. Think about this: Married couple. Once a bar does agree to appear on the show, things move pretty quickly. He became publicly well-known after hosting a reality TV series named Bar Rescue on a TV channel, Paramount Network. I know the show is scripted worse than professional wrestling. Then Day 4 is transformation day. However,Bar Rescue does the same thing with bars or restaurants that are down on their luck and need an upgrade. For example, Reality TV Revisited noted thatSwanky Bubbles (among many, many others) reverted to their original name, Piratz Tavern, returned to their much-maligned pirate theme. With that said, it says a lot about Maria that she can still see the silver lining in this whole saga. I look at this way: If youre into drugs, I wouldnt suggest you become a pharmacist. He and his crew got around 100 thousand dollars per episode from bar owners. I agree Scott. The opening of every show exclaims that the featured bar is ready to pull open the doors, bust out the books, and make a call to Bar Rescue for help. While Murphys Law did end up pulling open the doors and busting out the books, it never made a call to the show. Once the thing gets ugly, the owner show what are they really made of. Following years of managerial duties and owning his own bars, Taffer was appointed as president of the Nightclub and Bar Media Group in 2010. As bad as it is. Hes a reality TV producer and a half ass actor. Its just remarkable. Chef Brian Duffy is a complete moron. Bar Rescue is currently on hiatus, but you can watch it on Spike TV. This is Maria Bedient, the woman who was gracious enough to talk to me about her experience on Bar Rescue.. I understand the line goes around the building. He has a love of movies and television, having enjoyed them for more than twenty years. What was the worst Bar Rescue? Mia Mastroianni is one of Bar Rescues best mixologists. Check the link below for Phils announcement. Did you not read that he made Maria and staff wear the same clothes for 3 days straight? The premise: Taffer goes around and teaches people to be more like him. If Jon Taffer is the captain of the Bar Rescue squad, the rest of the team are sergeants and foot soldiers who go into the battle every episode . Paul was an owner of the Sand Dollar in Las Vegas, which was on season 3 of the show and renamed to Bar 702. Jon Taffer's reality show Bar Rescue is wild TV, but what are some behind the scenes facts fans should know? How long does it take to rescue a bar on Bar Rescue? The Show's Bar Owners Speak Out - 10 Gone Viral, Pingback: DiscoverNet | The Untold Truth Of Bar Rescue. BAR RESCUE FAIL #9 Gipsy. And son of a gun, thats what theyre doing. #BarRescue #ParamountNetworkParamount. Jon Taffer earned most of his money from reality TV series. These people are really, really in trouble. citizen's property hostage until she pays extra fees. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Performance". Maria is immediately labeled as a puppet master and all the editing and sound bites of her from that point on paint a portrait of a toxic individual who is set on destroying a business. For example, a POS system company might donate a brand new POS system for free in exchange for some coverage on the Bar Rescue episode. Lets dig in! The two met at Super Bowl XXX in 1996, and Jon fell in love with [her] at first sight, according to his official website. There isn't much information about why the bar closed as their Facebook Page has pretty much removed all posts and their website was taken down. To make the show more entertaining, one bar owner, Ryan Burks, said that the producers told him to lie about the amount of debt he had and that he was about to lose his home, according toMashed. Dont Blink. Indeed, Marty, Misty and Matt keep surprising us with the ingenious things they do to renovate homesteads on a budget and help novice homesteaders on the popular American reality series. Maria doesnt dispute that the bar had issues. Paramount Network Rebrand Bar Rescue To Move Channels Series such as Ink Master, Wife Swap and Battle of the Fittest Couples will all be canceled. So were changing lives. They never took their shirts off again. Jon Taffer and the reality TV producers were once sued by Paul Wilkes of Bar 702, according to Courthouse News. The business owner pays for the Bar Rescue improvements. This is why youll often see Jon Taffer specifically recognize the brand names of the products he installs. Do you cover the cost of the renovations and upgrades or do the bar owners have to pay some of it back? The owner doesn't pay one dime. Company Debts. Like I said, it doesnt take a reality TV guru to know that Bar Rescue is produced to attract viewers, not to tell the truth. Mashed noted thatTaffer got his first bartending job in 1973 when he was just 19years old. [laughs] I think they dont want to know what will happen if I dont. Things You Probably Didnt Know About Martin Landau, How Tanked Stars Built A 700 Gallon Fire and Water Aquarium, Brett Raymers Top 3 Favorite Fish Tanks From Tanked, How The Show Tanked Cleverly Repurposed These 3 Things Into Aquariums, The Legal Drama Behind the Tanked TV Show, The Lasting Legacy of Country Music Legends, The Highwaymen, Tanked Made an Unforgettable Fish Tank From a Drum Set. According to Jon Taffer, Jon and the show's sponsors pay for literally everything. Same with Storage Wars. Article continues below advertisement If the bars don't succeed, neither does he. Yellowstone will remain on the Paramount Movie Network. So were teaching them to bartend, cook the food all that. Similarly, according to eCelebrityFacts, Misty reportedly has a net worth of $300 thousand. According to Jon Taffer, Jon and the shows sponsors pay for literally everything. How does bar rescue work? Just like our president. Advertisement cookies are used to provide visitors with relevant ads and marketing campaigns. Are you from s4e8 with the Dirty Rooster? If you watch that episode, edited or not, there were some STUPID owner.s. We shoot for five days. So this is over for them, theyre done. How does the Jon Taffer show pay for Bar Rescue? Once the show converged on Marias bar, it didnt take long to realize that there was an agenda at play. His preferences include drama, action, and horror, with the former being a particular point of interest and fascination. Who pays for Bar Rescue improvements? The grand opening is a success. Its funny, its entertaining, and you learn something nearly every episode. Which episodes of Bar Rescue does John walk out on? 2. The owner doesnt pay one dime. And theyre doing incredibly well. How often does a mobile home need to be leveled? Jon Taffer, veterans day is tomorrow. My sponsors and I pay for everything. These cookies will be stored in your browser only with your consent. Its really about more than the bar. Talk about lying for clicks. Sherman in the Ozark Mountains, Ozark County. She doesnt hide the fact that it has been a very tough road since the Bar Rescue experience started. Unfortunately, many of these bars are simply too far gone. Then Discovery Channel proposed the Homestead Rescue idea, after which the network got in touch with Raw Productions to execute the idea. Jon Taffer is essentially the bar-version of Gordon Ramsey, who uses his over thirty years of experience as a food and beverage industry consultant to help desperate nightclubs, bars, and pubs reinvent themselves so they don't have to close. In an interview, he said, As far as the budget is concerned, this is obviously a Discovery Show. If youve wondered about this, youve come to the right place. Taffers Bar Rescuenotorietyensures he now gets top-notch service at restaurants and bars. And the angriest he ever got was to the owner of the failing Denver bar, Zanzibar. It was largely aimed at people who were fans ofa specific team but couldn't watch their games owing to designated market areas. Lmao. In the TV show Bar Rescue, who pays all of the costs? It took a year before Maria could even talk about the experience. Before that, the reality star was featured as the expedition guide in the documentary Alaska, Spirit Of the Wild (1997). From lawsuits to grim tales, let's look. But Ive got to tell you, I watch Bar Rescue on a computer as were going through the editing process and such. Marty Raney, the family patriarch, was raised off-grid in Mt. I have never met any of the homesteaders before until the day I drive into their property. Of all the nightclub scenes shown in movies and TV, Taffer's reality show and expertise exceed those scenes. How would you describe an honorable person? Maria explained to me that the main producer talked to all Murphy's Law employees who appeared on the show separately. With over 11.5K followers on Instagram, Nicole makes regular appearances on her husbands show, Bar Rescue. And the last day is reveal day. If youre into drinking and partying, I wouldnt suggest you open a bar. Launched on November 27, 1994, NFL Sunday Ticket served as a way to broadcast out-of-market games to local affiliates. 4 Suraj Acharya Worked at Nimble Storage (company) Updated 5 y It's something like a gift to the bars by the various organizations. In every case, their families are involved, their lives are on the line, their retirements are on the line, this is serious stuff. Which is the best season of Bar Rescue? Bar Rescues move also never took place, as its eighth season premiered on Paramount Network on May 2, 2021. Some of the drinks and food shown at some of these bars are some of the worst-looking on TV. How does the Jon Taffer show pay for Bar Rescue? Roles were developed and certain behaviors encouraged. 6. The name of his new show is, .wait for it, Face the TRUTH !! judd hirsch montana eve hirsch; canadian embassy in uganda website; nico collins singer height; love finds a home full movie youtube; mock trial taglines I have noticed several times that the employees have a transmitter attached to them during the recon scene. At only 16, Raney quit school and moved to Alaska, where he launched his life. The employees played their parts, took their lumps, and put on their smiles after the bar was remodeled and renamed. RELATED:10 Funniest John Taffer Quotes, Ranked. Has to be or no one would watch it. He is mainly involved in weightlifting. They take pictures every few hours to compare how you look. Cleveland police search for hit-and-run driver who mowed down hairdresser outside of a bar. They get new pos machines. How are the mixology trainers and Chefs compensated?. The first noticeable flaw is that the bar owner is belligerent and excessively drunk the previous night, but 8am the next morning he is perfectly sober with no sign of a hangover. Champagne's Cafe - OPEN. A ham is a derogatory nickname for someone from Framingham, so the name Angry Hams Garage is a slap in the face to the whole town. Best regards. Who pays for all the renovations on Bar Rescue? Also, just like what Bryden Vukasintold me about The Bachelorrete, show producers had the Murphys Law staff perform certain tasks/scenes over and over. Youre the first media Ive mentioned that too. Marty revealed just who pays for the renovations on Homestead Rescue. Recently I came in contact with Maria Bedient, a real life person who was featured prominently on the fifth season of Bar Rescue. However, dont think the word prominently translates to accurately or glowingly. At the end of the episode, viewers couldn't wait to see which establishment turned into aBar Rescue failure or a Bar Rescue success. These cookies help provide information on metrics the number of visitors, bounce rate, traffic source, etc. Maybe Dr. Phil, another drama king, should have made Jon the first guest instead of one of the judges. So who pays for it? Some of the manipulation was more damaging. This is the category where the family falls. So to make a long story short, its five 12-hour days in a row. The show began airing on Spike on July 17, 2011 and completed its eighthseason in August 2021. R. Lee's - CLOSED. A lot of the guys think, Im the guy Taffers going to love. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Question: Who Pays For The Renovations on Kitchen Nightmares? The Bar Rescue finances are complicated. Really disgusted. Accordingly, the show covers the fees for a few months until the bar reaches stable footing, at which point its up to the owners to take over the lease terms. The short answer is that the bar owners pay for the privilege of having their bar featured on the show. The rescue happened back in February 2022 and Jon changed the name of JF Kicks to Jimmy's, in honor of his brother's legacy. The main reason for the show's success lies in host Jon Taffera nightlife consultant who brings a fiery intensity to every episode. The reality tv star admits that he had been pitching several networks for a reality television series. Who is the female mixologist on Bar Rescue? Plus you get Norm and the gang doing some of the work. The bar is very spacious I need it totally renovated It doesnt happen that way. . Does Jon Taffer and his team pick up the tab or are the already struggling bar owners expected to pay for their new stuff? We use cookies on our website to give you the most relevant experience by remembering your preferences and repeat visits. Jon Taffer, star of Paramount Network's "Bar Rescue," has hired thousands of people over his 35-year career as an entrepreneur. That process used to be facilitated by Metal Flowers Media, which lists its affiliation with Bar Rescue as lasting from 2010 to 2018. After Gary pleaded for Maria to return to the bar, thereby turning his back on the advice Taffer gave him, she has experienced the small positive fruits of the Bar Rescue exposure. Losing business is one thing; losing your sense of self is another. 10. When the gift of thousand and thousand of dollars appear for free, in equipment, training, and also exposure on TV, the bussines will rise for a year or two, as long as the gift remains active then, the magic will be over. But he doesn't wash his hands of said bars completely. According toReality TV Updates, Taffer and his sponsors pay for the entire renovation. It does not store any personal data. Does the bar rescue team do small bars like on a small lake? . The Discovery Channel covers all costs associated with the renovations, including materials, labor, and other expenses that may arise during production. Nothing fancy, just your run-of-the-mill college town sports bar. Bar Rescue is a television show that helps struggling bars and nightclubs. My sponsors and I pay for everything. Encouraged to showcase Murphys Law as an incompetent hellhole, they did just that. Reality TV has to have Comedy, Drama, A Plot, And a let down. The recon team pays to get into the nightclub. Jon heads to the Kiva Lounge & Bar in San Marcos, TX, where he confronts its cocky yet inexperienced co-owners and is appalled by their sweaty and shockingly unhygienic cook. To him, that proves his business principles work. The TV network covers many of the high-level costs. When Im out, if [the service staff] really screws up, then I get angry, but normally I tend to deal with it, Im out to have a good time. Believe it or not, Bar Rescue contacted various Reno area bars to gauge interest in appearing in an episode. A typical episode begins with Taffers team performing reconnaissance and surveillance on a struggling bar to determine its operational and service weaknesses. So they make 1 bar where the same clothes every day yet at another place, they only film for a single day? Fans of the show frequently drop in at Murphys Law solely because they saw it on TV. Jon Taffer is a famous television personality, entrepreneur, and businessman who owns a net worth of $15 million. It was very clear that they had shot the entire thing in a single day, were too lazy to have the employees change clothing, and faked that this took place over a 5 days span. Maria couldnt have made this more clear. Accordingly, the show covers the fees for a few months until the bar reaches stable footing, at which point its up to the owners to take over the lease terms. That's when the cameras are put in place, and the bar owners are given a heads up on the day he's going to be arriving. It's funny, it's entertaining, and you learn something nearly every episode. The bar didn't have the most disgusting things Taffer found, it was just not up to code. If a borrower cant make his monthly payment over the long-term, the , What Is a Residential Designer? We use cookies. The comes Day Two. However, sometimes the show takes the embarrassment a little too far. But this dude didnt have write 2 books just to say nothing. I have seen almost all the season and episodes as I can stand for, plenty of those bars are destinated to fail, because (as any bussines) the manager or the owner dont have all the job requirements for running a specific kind of bussines, the bar its ok as the sales are ok, but once the sales goes bad, they dont have the means to recover, because a lot of entreprenours are fooled by the idea that owning a bar its about party and high reneuves. A little backstory on how the Raneys got to have their own TV show: Although Marty and his family pride in living off-grid, the gregarious patriarch has appeared in various TV shows and documentaries. Maria credits the Bar Rescue personnel for being nice and helpful up front, but it soon became hard to accept it as genuine. The owner doesnt pay one dime. And it happens all the time. In the spirit of keeping things authentic and minimalistic, Discovery Channel encourages Marty and his team to reuse, repurpose, and recycle whatever they can to save money when renovating these homesteads. They served that tainted food to my daughter. BAR RESCUE FAIL #1: Swanky Bubbles. And they STILL dont clean up. I have seen every episode but this last season seems too staged. But what she does vehemently deny is the type/cause of issues Bar Rescue portrayed the bar to have. I don't know why it was on the show, tbh. Do you cover the cost of the renovations and upgrades or do the bar owners . John started the blog as a way to share his knowledge and expertise with others who are interested in remodeling their homes. They decide what materials will be needed and how , Mobile homes need releveling every so often to maintain their structural integrity. Yet not all of the bars on Bar Rescue ultimately get saved. And as Jon gets equity in each bar he helps remodel, in addition to his fees for appearing, consulting, and being the face of the show . Then, individual sponsors cover the cost of specific products in exchange for exposure on the show. So I show up, and theyre UNBELIEVABLY drunk. The third day is all about training. We even leave them with food & beverage inventory, along with plates, silverware, glassware, and everything they need. Believe it or not, after the show aired Maria received hate mail from viewers unable to decipher the truth about reality television. You cant fix stupid. Taffers consulting firm, Taffer Dynamics, Inc. We appreciated the opportunity to do Bar Rescue, but their vision was clearly different from ours and it is time to get back to what we love doing! One of the most remarkable moments [involving bad owners] came during last Sundays episode. To think that we went from a physical altercation to THAT in four days was remarkable to me. LA Brew Co - CLOSED. 4 How long does it take to rescue a bar on Bar Rescue? A local bar owner once featured on "Bar Rescue" who served 90 days in jail after he pleaded guilty to assault with intent to commit sexual abuse is back in handcuffs after failing to register as a sex offender, among other charges. The lender requires an appraisal for home equity loansno matter the typeto protect itself from the risk of default. Anyway, this individual story ends well as now Kevin and Brittany are regular Murphys Law patrons and friends with Gary and Maria. It's not clear if this is a one-time deal or if it will continue for seasons 2 and 3. Download to watch offline and even view it on a big screen using Chromecast. Spike ordered 10 episodes of the show, and it began shooting in April of 2011. Johnny decided not to keep the name and reverted back to JF Kicks a short time after the rescue. If the bar has reverted those changes, did things get better or worse? Who pays for renovations on Bar Rescue show? Its real, he says. Have you ever wondered who pays for the renovations on Bar Rescue? Hey Alyson Thanks for taking the time to comment. This inspection uncovered years' worth ofunacknowledged and non-permittedbuilding renovations. Buy Bar Rescue: Season 8 on Google Play, then watch on your PC, Android, or iOS devices. Rather than bringing the building up to code, The Gazette Review saidthe owners decided to close. The new season marks the shows return to traveling across the country after solely filming in Las Vegas during the COVID-19 pandemic. Bar Rescue: 13 Behind The Scenes Facts You Should Know About Jon Taffer's Reality Show, 5 Of The Funniest Bar Rescue Episodes & 5 Of The Worst, Ranked, 8 Reality Cooking Shows That Aren't Real (& 7 We Think Are), Why 90 Day Fianc's Colt Johnson May Exit The Franchise, 90 Day Fiancs Memphis Smith Files For Bankruptcy, 90 Day Fianc: How Shaeeda Is Excelling With Her Yoga Business. While each of these owners said on air the business could survive for only another three months, Taffer says only five have since closed, giving the show an impressive success rate of about 90%. and The Chicken Bone reverted to its old menu. I have in fact talked to both sides. He has owned 17 different hospitality businesses, founded consulting firm Taffer Dynamics, and even helped create the NFLs Sunday Ticket.. The more I demanded this, the more Raw Productions and Discovery became excited.. Hes not going to scream at me. By clicking Accept, you consent to the use of ALL the cookies. They make the money available for significant homestead improvements, but I have to convince them that a homestead needs this and that project completed.. A major part in the Emergency Exit episode of Bar Rescue is when Jon Taffer and the three owners meet outside Murphys Law for a frank discussion. The last episode of Homestead Rescue aired in December 2021, but you can still watch reruns of your favourite home improvement show on your preferred streaming platform. Jon Taffer net worth: Jon Taffer is an American restaurateur and businessman who has a net worth of $14 million dollars. Im sorry, your bar does not qualify for this program. The cookies is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Necessary". Not only is that number inaccurate, but Bar Rescue never even followed up in the first place. Bar Rescue and Lip Sync Battle made the cut and will continue on, but will be moved to another ViacomCBS channel. Nathan Sharp is a writer from outside Toronto, Ontario. Also keep in mind most of these places ARE in the financial red,,,the likelihood of success with or without help is unlikely.
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